Contrairimairi sent me the video below. The Department of Energy employs more than 16,000 full time bureaucrats and 100,000 contractors. CW Roberts and his colleague show how to solve the oil spill problem. We can replace the entire Department of Energy with these two guys. They've produced more value in this video than 16,000 bureaucrats and 100,000 contractors.
Check out Mitchell Langbert's blog: http://www.mitchell-langbert.blogspot.com
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121 comments:
I hope the Department of Energy will listen to these two men.
It sure sounds like a good solution.
Brilliant!
American ingenuity can alwasy come through if the government will get out of the way. This is Capitalism at its best--Washington, are you listening?? and comprehending??
Is the best kind of hay to use Fescue, Alfalfa, timothy, brome, fescue, Bermuda grass, orchard grass. When is the best time to cut and bale the hay to maximize absorption...what day of the month or time of the is best?? Hopefully our leaders in Washington will form a committee and then vote on them to see who is best suited for the task and then table a bill to accept the nominations. Then the committee can research this and get back with us!!
Here's a tip for the US Government, SWALLOW YOUR PRIDE AND LISTEN TO THE PEOPLE, we know what we're talking about!
Ok first off. Where are you going to get that much hay? 2. How are you going to stir it. 3. How are you going to scoop it all back up again?
Plus they are using refined oil IIRC, which is different than crude and sheen. It's a great idea but on a grand scale it's simply not practical.
Where will they get hay? Its not like there isn't already a SHIT TON of that stuff growing everywhere. Hell, it is pretty much a friggin weed!
How are you going to stir it? Well, considering that the hay floats and oil is immiscible, it will just soak up the oil on the surface. Churning can be accomplished by the waves and by boats, as explained in the video.
Scooping it back up again? Use a boat, perhaps? Gather it up when on shore?
The solution is VERY CHEAP, it uses GREEN TECHNOLOGY (literally) and requires little effort.
Let's get some crude in a swimming pool and try it out!
To the commenter who asked about the type of hay, when it's cut, best for absorbtion, etc. Any hay will do, the types he mentioned were chosen for their availability more than anything. Alfalfa and other specialty grasses would be more expensive and are not grown extensively in the coastal areas. It's a little early to cut hay right now, but you could source alot of last years hay. Also, there isn't an issue of absorbtion, but adherence. The oil will attach to the grass, so when you colect the grass you collect the oil. Grass floats, so it is easily collected and disposed of. Crude oil is more viscous (thicker) so it would catch more crude than refined oil. Also, no need to "stir" as the sirring was only done to mimic the natural wave action; add hay and the gulf will stir. If nothing else, it is a great way to protect beaches, filtering the oil before it gets in the sand, it's cheap, and it's proven. It is used in construction stormwater permits and on slopes to slow or prevent erosion. The difference is that it acts as a block to soil erosion, but it actually picks up the oil.
A) Hay is pretty readily available.
B) The ocean moves a lot, the natural waves would stir it up. But during calm seas boats could drive through it to stir.
C) Hay floats on the surface so collecting it would be pretty simple proccess.
D) They are using used motor oil, which has less viscosity than the sweet crude that is flowing in the Gulf. Having more viscosity will actually make it work even better on the oil in the Gulf.
This is what I sent to the Coast Guard and Homeland Security
To Whom It May Concern:
I am a retired mechanical engineer who served six years in the Merchant Marines during and following WW2 and then spent 40 years as a mechanical designer/engineer working in the shipyards and on off-shore rigs along the Gulf of Mexico, Scotland, Singapore and Japan among other countries. I have an idea for cleaning up the oil spill from the BP rig disaster now threatening wildlife, fishing, and sensitive ecosystems along the Gulf Coast near Louisiana. Please read the synopsis of my ideas and send them on to the proper person or let me know where to send them.
Since the well head is in such deep water and likely covered by debris from the rig making it hard to shut down, the only practical solution now is to absorb the oil from the surface of the water and dispose of it on shore. My idea, based on one I witnessed that turned Singapore harbor from a trash-filled and polluted waterway to one in almost pristine condition, is to scoop the oil up onto barges for transport to disposal or recycling sites on shore. You can do this by spreading a dry, absorption material, such as hay that will attract the oil, over the surface of the oil slick. Allow the material to absorb the oil, then drive a fleet of barges all attached with a raker or large scoop to scoop or rake up the oil-soaked hay and dump it back into the barge, which would have a large carrying capacity. The barges would be propelled by detachable propulsion units that would drive them into the area of contamination and begin to rake up the oil-soaked hay. The barge would be outfitted with collector facilities like a broad conveyer to pull the contaminated hay into the barge where the water would be separated out and returned to the sea. The barge would then go to a designated area on shore where the oil could be separated from the hay thru presses or rollers or other means. This oil would not be contaminated with other chemicals and could be sent to a refinery.
I witnessed a similar process in Singapore harbor in the mid-1980s with barges outfitted with giant scoops and rakes, a kind of ocean-going bulldozer. The harbor went from one of the worst I had ever seen to one that was as near pristine as it could get. I hope you find this worthy of consideration. I can be reached at 817-478-6372, or 7600 Anglin Drive, Fort Worth Texas 76140.
Sincerely, Charles A. Brink
If this works so well why wait so long!! Some would say----Jus-Git-R-Dun.....
I have read the comments on how will they stir it.....well didn't they listen at the first they said the waves will do the same as stirring. But maybe those people that didn't listen are government type people and wanting to spend more money. They probably think can't be that simple or cheap.
But the Lord has put everything on earth and there is something to clean up the mess without having to be man made.. I pray they listen but they never do......
"They" (whoever is at the top of the burocratic food chain at the time) have a lot of resources to mobilize but a lot of baggage to carry as well. Too much to be truly innovative and responsive to new ideas. American ingenuity based on the common sense solutions of people with hands on experience is what made this country so great (and, of course, the freedom to apply that resource). I hope the county and state officials in the affected areas move ahead with this instead of waiting on a "unified" big government approach.
As for future similar oil spills where oil is seeping from deep sea openings, incineration technology exists for positioning bell shaped, gas fired incinerators over deep water leaks to incinerate the oil at the source until the wells can be permenantly sealed via the drilling and pumping technique that will ultimately be used to seal this leak.
Listen up Americuh!
What a great idea Guys!! It's going to have to be something simple to prevent the oil from hitting the beaches and this could be the solution! Well done!
I think that this is a spectacular idea! Even hay that is no longer good for animal forage would probably still have adsorptive qualities. Furthermore, the hay could be used with the oil booms to collect the oil that accumulates there. I certainly hope that you will be able to implement this idea at the site of the spill. A word of advice - do not give up! Use every last avenue available to you to contact people who will use their influence to advance your idea. Hound them until someone listens. Invite them to come and see your experiments, or go to them with a mobile demonstration. Call any and all individuals and organizations you can think of who might be able to get this into action. The comment by Bettu was very enlightening, and he gives his contact information. He tells how this can be implemented, from start to finish. You all should call him immediately!
From a scientific point of view, if would help if you could weigh the amount of oil you use in each bowl, and the amount of each hay you use in each bowl, and then weigh the hay after you remove it from the water. This will give you the weight of the oil which is collected per amount of hay. You would probably need to use additional amounts of oil so you could determine the maximum amount a certain amount of hay could hold. Do this with your different kinds of hay. You also need to record the elapsed time of contact of the hay with the water. Using various amounts of times would be helpful, and you could find out when additional time yields no more adsorption, in other words, you would find the endpoint. You might also find out the temperature of the Gulf water at various points, and try your oil adsorption by the hay at these temperatures. If you could obtain some oil that has a similar viscosity to that in the ocean, it would make you experiments just that more accurate and relevant, and you might have a better chance of convincing those in power to listen to you. People are impressed by the use of numbers.
There are so many volunteers who have boats, fuel, and equipment, and are ready at a moment's notice to help, and just need to be told what to do. Logistically, this will also entail the help of people inland who have access to the hay and the capability to transport it. Hopefully, all that would be necessary would be to alert people to the need, and I think the response would be overwhelming. Out here in West Texas, we have a lot of hay, with farmers who have the means to transport it, even if it is only one pickup with spikes on the back to carry one round bale. It would be immensely interesting to find out how much one round bale of hay could adsorb. We might be surprised!
You know, you might even need to go to Louisiana yourselves, and to the areas where the oil is, and take some hay, and try this idea out in situ. Maybe you might get more people interested whose waters and land are being impacted with the oil right now.
The removal of as much oil as possible from the Gulf, as soon as possible, is imperative as we are soon to enter the hurricane season. Of course, hurricanes and tropical storms send water coursing to the shore, and a long way inland, and in this regard, any land touching the Gulf of Mexico is vulnerable. We must also remember the ability of the Loop Current to carry the oil around Florida, throughout the Keys, into the Atlantic, and up the Eastern shores. The need for action could not be more imminent!
Well, I am sure that there are many more scientists who are better able to help you design your experiments, and others who are much better able to help you find people of influence to carry out your plan. But, I wish the very best of luck to you all, and I will be waiting with bated breath for the results, and will doing everything I can here from Texas.
The response to hay has been tremendous (and by the way we changed our identity name from Bettu which was a typo to our first names, Charles and Betty.) I was impressed greatly with the video and it encouraged me to post my letter to the Coast Guard and Homeland Security. Now, per Georgia's suggestion, I'll send it even further. And to all who read this feel free to forward it to any and all who might help get this idea moving. From the looks of the "solutions" so far, I think that oil is going to be covering the Gulf for a long time. And there is another dry material that can be used, it is baggasse, the very dry residue left over from squeezing the juice out of sugar cane. Keep this idea moving. Charles Brink
When traveling thru Nebraska and South Dakota I saw thousands of big round bales just rotting. Lets put them to use..... Jim
Farmers have millions of tons of hay sitting in their storage barns; use that first. If we are hauling truck loads of plastic floating bouys and skirts from all over the country to the Gulf we can probably figure out how to haul hay. Put it on the shore as a buffer and eventually burn it for energy.
You missed one other major benefit here...
First, this is an excellent approach. It’s a shame that our government doesn’t posses common sense but that’s another story.
The hay could be dropped from the air on the visible patches of oil and all along the coast before the spill approaches the shore.
However, another huge benefit is created as it comes to shore. The oil-laden hay will pile up all along the shoreline and form its own natural oil boom.
This will form a barrier to keep out oil that has not yet been absorbed by the hay from coming ashore.
This layer of hay can act as a natural barrier to keep the oil offshore, which will give the sun more time to break the oil down and minimize cleanup.
The main objective is to stop the migration of the oil back into the sensitive wetlands.
The longer the oil stays offshore, the better the situation becomes. After the well has been capped and the oil standing offshore has moved into the existing hay, the hay may be retrieved and disposed.
Three cheers for these guys! They deserve a medal but I doubt they will get one from this administration because they are thinking and working!
Think of all the Bermuda lawns across the south! It's the same weed, just cut short. Get home owners to cut it a few days later than usual, allow it to dray a day or two then rake and bag it for trucking to the barges. It would take a collective effort, but is within the realm of possibility and would provide a great source.
Gosh, the fact that straw/hay have been used for many, many years to soak up oil spills (see for example http://www.gma.org/surfing/human/savethebay.html, from 2000) should not get in the way of proclaiming everyone else to be total idiots.
After all, the claim that these two guys discovered something new and miraculous was posted on the internet, so it must be true, right?
Anonymous: I'm curious: where did you hear that the Federal Reserve Bank "stimulates" the economy? That the money it creates is distributed evenly? Did you hear this in school? On television?
As far as the Department of Energy being composed of idiots, that does not depend on this video. That is just an observation about a pointless government bureaucracy. The DOE is a bunch of idiots regardless of the origination of Mr. Roberts's idea.
Quite Simply...there's no POWER in it...therefore, let go of your hopes for government to listen. That's a silly pipedream. Change must come first. Real solutions don't beget power.
You can actually do something to help!
Hair works much better than hay due to it's increased surface area. Hair is already being collected from 90,000 donors. Look it up on google. Better yet sign up to help here:
Gulf Coast Oil Spill Clean Up: Help by Donating your Hair!
Thanks in advance to Mitchell Langbert.
Guys good work.
We certainly have very little to lose, the cost is small, the process simple, benefits great. It is well worth a try, because what the government and BP is doing is not really working all that well. Time to try some other things.
Guys I hope you contact the governors of Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, and Florida. Hopefully someone will see value in trying this solution. Maybe even the Universities in those states, could step up run some pilot programs.
An entrepreneur with resources, can see the potential business opportunity.
I am not going to suggest this will not work. However, why are you blasting the government for something it did not cause?? (unless you're talking about the slack regulations of the Bush years - thanks very much Mr. Cheney, Halliburton, etc.) Your efforts should be directed to BP! In fact, why should the government be involved in this? It's a PRIVATE SECTOR problem! BP's spill = BP's $$ to clean up. Don't smack the fed with one hand and then put your other hand out for help!
Hay won't work - because you need a beaurocracy thats interested, to organize it, and the current one is not interested in cleaning up the spill.
Its as simple as that.
They'd rather polllute the entire ocean of the world, kill all sea life and starve us of the 80% atmospheric oxygen that come from the sea.
The way they've reacted to it
I actually think the spill was deliberate.
If you want to clean it up, clean up Washington first. there's 500 of them and 300 million of you!
Gee, this sounds like an excellent idea, fairly inexpensive, eco-friendly, and, according to other comments, has been used before with good effect.
Unfortunately, this idea won't put the right kind of money in the right kind of hands, and so, this idea probably will not be considered.
These 2 guys need to go to their Senator or US Representative ASAP. It looks promising, but it's a whole different ball game in ocean size quantities. Hard to believe there isn't some research out there somewhere that would substantiate their ideas or demonstrate why it wouldn't work. If there isn't, some researcher somewhere would be happy to design with these guys a practical study with the current situation.
Could this idea cause a shorage of hay for livestock feed? The quantity of grass/hay required for a project of this magnatude will be VERY large and could have the possability to affect cattle/food prices? But, our government currently pays farmers to keep productive farm land inactive (CRP), all of this ground is planted into various forms of grass/hay, but is not cut and grows unabated. starting in a couple weeks we could start to cut some of the grass in this program (CRP) in some of the southern, maybe a couple more weeks for the midwest. Farmers and ranchers get a bonus, and BP gets to save face by using green to help fix their mess.
Mr. Langbert, I have been calling and emailing all kinds of people about this. I don't think I'm talking to the right people. Where would be the best place for me to "show up" to speak with someone about this? I've been tweeting it too!
This really is brilliant except for the effect on the wildlife. any animal, fish, turtle, or any other wildlife will see this as food. The oil in the hay would poison them. Animals typically have a flight response during oil spills and move away anyway. but seeing as this is a quick response, the animals will learn not to flee and eat the hay instead.
Farmers of America unite! Load up your trucks with
hay, head for the Gulf. The workers along the Gulf will help lay it down to save the wetlands and our food supply. You get it going and the people will come.
No way will anyone listen to these guys or anyone else only the "experts" can solve this, these hayseeds need to go home and be quiet.
Simple cheep solutions are not the order of the day.
THIS IS A VERY GOOD IDEA, JUST DUMP TONS OF DAWN DISHWASHING LIQUID INTO OIL SPILLS. THIS LIQUID WILL CAUSE IT TO GATHER UP IN ONE SPOT. IT WILL NOT HURT THE WATER, OR WILDLIFE AND FISHERIES.IF YOU DONT BELIEVE IT PUT SOME OIL AND WATER INTO A PAN AND DROP SOME DAWN INTO IT AND IT WILL CAUSE IT TO SEPERATE.
Hay Was Used Successfully On The
1969 Santa Barbara Oil Spill
The Two American Farmers Are Right - All Available Hay Should
Begin To Move To The Gulf Immediately.
http://www.rense.com/general90/barb.htm
In your heading...Professonally, I am an associate professor. I blog about current events, politics, higher education,
Professonally should be spelled Professionally
Maybe shredding a few billion fiat dollars that the Fed prints could be used as well as hay and hair. Those dollars are so full of nothing they should float for a long time.
keith
Its not surprising to me that a couple of farmers can seemingly outsmart 100,000 bureaucrats in Washington. The question is, do the bureaucrats in Washington want to solve this problem ? does it work in their interest ?
If they wanted to solve this problem could they do it without just bumping into each other all the time ?
The whole system is set up so these people are bumping into each other all the time. It generates waste and that is the purpose of government. Waste keeps the common man working, paying taxes and not thinking so the aristocrats can keep raping him. See The Report From Iron Mountain - its free on the web. (75 pages- best 75 pages anywhere)
Potash is what they use on oil downs at the dragstrip.its ash.
I saw this on you tube,, this is Brilliant!!! So what do you do with the soiled hay? ,,,Make Asphalt with it,, America needs new roads,, This would produce a ton of work,,who gonna pay for all this? BP that's who..See America always rises to the occasion,, by the way isn't this the start of growing season?? I say organize a hay cleanup with folks, bringing america together again in a seriou crises...are you listening? congress?????
This is old news - a seventh grader used this idea, and a better material, in a State science fair I judged almost 20 years ago. Don't use straw, use wool. The oil can even be recovered. How? A conveyor belt with a wool blanket on the fronts of a fleet of watercraft can sop up the oil, wring out the belt, and recover the oil. Get with the '80s, people!!!
http://asianenergy.blogspot.com/2010/05/hay-was-used-successfully-on-1969-santa.html
apparently this method has already proven successful.
There is still a much more apparent concern and that is that the hole still gushes oil from the earth. Whatever method is used-the oil flow needs to stop.
Cover it,clog it, vacuum it, seal it, cap it, cement it. Just the fact that its been a month already is pretty DARNED ridiculous.
Dear Myra Broussard: The only things I can think of is write or call your Congressman and Senators. Someone mentioned that British Petroleum is responsible for this and should be held accountaable, which is certainly the case. However, given that the Department of Energy employs so many employees and contractors, you might think that an event of this kind with so many public ramifications might be of some concern to it. Perhaps contact them as well.
Hay, what a great idea!
Scot
I would like to see a test of what chemicals are left in the water when the hay is removed.
Nevertheless, picking up some chemicals is better than none.
I would suggest that if this method is used, that a de-seeded straw made from the invasive plant phragmites be used to soak up the oil instead of hay, which is valuable to those using it to feed animals. I would not want to cause a price spike for the farmers/ranchers such as occurred when corn started to be used for ethanol. There is a helluva lot of invasive phragmites out there choking our wetlands and nobody is going to miss it.
OK, this is simple, brilliant and cheap and most of all sounds absoutely do-able!! Do you really think the dept of Energy will even entertain this idea? Heck no!!! not after spending millions on useless solutions and tons of hours on a bunch of suits in so-called think tanks getting paid a fortune to come up with a viable solution to this problem. To think two simple (albeit brilliant farmers)guys could solve this problem without $$$$ and hours upon hours of work, would be viewed as an enormous embarrassment.
Personally, I am proud of these guys! This is American ingenuity and problem solving at its best! This s the spirit that made this country great! A dying breed. We now throw our hands up in the air as though we were helpless and let a bunch of politicians, pencil pushing self interested, fast talking types make our decisions for us. For sure someone will squash this rather simplistic solution in favor of a truly expensive one that will bring attention to some self interest group.
The problem with taking an idea like this and mounting a swift and effective cleanup operation as a response to a disaster of this magnitude is that there would then be no crisis from which to gain a political advantage. There would be no leverage against drilling. The public might actually begin to see "big oil" as slightly less of villain. They may be less inclined to regulate and tax their "obscene profits". And so forth. No, this would not be compatible with the current administration's agenda. Won't happen. They need a big mess.
This is an excellent idea. And if you disagree, fine, but has anyone else even got a clue as to what to do?
Bottom line here is that this was no accident to begin with. They claim that a gas bubble caused the explosion. There are pressure valves, gauges, and regulators on oil rigs to prevent that from happening. Natural gas and oil are form in very similar ways, and are often found together.
Love the man or hate him, fact is that Obama just signed a bill to start drilling off the coast of California. It seemed to be a sure deal until this. Now the leader of the state of California are saying no way.
Now I won't point fingers to any particular person here as I simply don't know who did it. But I'm fairly certain as to why, and I can promise you there will be no real effort to stop this disaster from reaching shore.
My heart really goes out to these two simple farmers. The solution they offer will work and HAS worked in the past (Santa Barbara oil spill.) But, you see, they are not government "experts."
Also, this is not a "spill" but a catastrophic disaster far beyond what the media is telling you, as usual. This is absolutely unprecedented.
It is fitting that our dysfunctional civilization should drown in an ocean of oil. But, it is self-inflicted suicide due to a philosophy of complete ignorance, selfish greed and insane warfare upon Mother Earth who sustains all--even the foolishly ignorant until they finally commit suicide.
Many say, "oh, but we NEED oil." Not so. We could have had ALL the free energy we would ever need SIXTY YEARS AGO. Yes indeed. Do you doubt that? Of course you do because you are not familiar with Nicola Tesla who proved this possibility as have many others since his time. Suppression of how to permanently solve ALL energy problems has a long history and a trail of bodies too. You see, there's no $$$ in solving the energy problem. But OIL, like $$$ and WAR are great manipulators and controllers of our presently enslaved society.
GREED and CRIMINALITY won out once again in this case which is so typical. Business as usual.
So, here now is the RESULT of it.
Judge the tree by the fruit it bears.
Now, everything they try to do will make it worse. Obama has now sent NUCLEAR SCIENTISTS down there, for example. So, wonderful! Let us now ignite a hydrogen bomb to "solve" the problem, that should work. After all a FIRE BALL is the ultimate of our wonderful materialst/realist/reductionistic fasely so-called "scientific" paradigm which we are all fully enculcated with from the cradle to the grave-- another unquestioned part of our "belief system."--very similar to a fanatical sectarian religion.
We all believe that to solve any problem SHEER POWER such as NUKES are the answer. After all, Hollywood does it all the time to "save the day." Aren't those FIRE BALLS beautiful?
When Nicola showed his financiers how to tap the unlimited free energy ALL AROUND US, J.P. Morgan and George Westinghouse (the HEROS of $$$ SUCCESS), answered, "BUT WE CAN'T PUT A METER ON IT." Uh huh--that's right.
So now let us eat the hydro-carbon lunch we ourselves have prepared through our sheer foolishness. Yum yum.
the dick heads in Washington are a sleep at the wheel!
If the Gulf border states don't want to do something about it, contact the governor of Arizona. She is getting things done, without listening to the government.
This is an AMAZING solution. Please listen and do it. I live in Florida and love my state. Let the news sources know. Maybe this is a story they will publish!
Looks great at first but as a person that works in a lab, I would like them to use sea water and the same type of crude. Then I would like to use to scale the amount of oil that's in the gulf and use a known amount of hay. As far as the edges on the bowl, it's already on the shoreline. Then what would the farmers do this coming winter for feed and what would that do to the price of beef?
Forget about telling the government. Send this idea to BP, and let them handle it!! Since they're paying for it, they would probably be more inclined to listen to the idea!!
Hi Guys, your idea is very very good, however I do have one suggestion to improve it, there is a company up in Canada that I have worked with in the past that Torrefies biomass and I think you should contact them to see if they may be interested in Torrefying your hay before using it. Their system is mobile and could be done in the gulf region. The torrefaction process makes the hay completely hydrophobic to water but still allows it to absorb oil thus making the retrievel of the straw that much easier. Using torrefied hay/straw will require less volume as well.
Hate to do a sales pitch but I think together you guys may have a complete solution. The guy you should contact is Mark Lowe and his email is mlowe@terradyneenergy.com
I have a neighbor here in Wyoming who has at least 30,000 tons of baled alfalfa/grass hay (large squares) that he has been stockpiling for years-waiting for the price to go up! These large squares are easy to load and haul as they are built like a large crate! Just think how many of these struggling trucking companies could come out on top if they were paid to start hauling semi loads of Hay to the Gulf! Putting America to work is the name of the game!
One thing is true though-obama (I won't even capitalize his name I hate the man so much) will sit there and study and study the problem and let it become a bigger catastrophe that it already is!
D from Wyo
To depend solely on the government to fix this mess would be a terrible mistake. The oil companies created this situation, not the government. We should be directing our suggestions primarily to the oil companies. They have the money and resources required to undertake such a project. We simply do not have the time it will take the government to get started on this, let alone get it done. If we could convince the oil companies of the value and potential of the ideas stated here, they could get the process underway while the government decides what it wants to do. Time is of the essence and the government is not well known for making anything happen fast. Our ecology and economy is in critical danger and we all need to act NOW.
Does anyone think the government really wants to clean up this mess right now? Frankly, I believe it was a plot by the government to begin with to prove to us stupid Americans (which seems to be what they think of us) that it is not in our best interest to drill our own oil as well as this is another ploy to destroy more of our economy, which seem to be Obama's goal. We were going to Panama city for vacation because my grand daughter is playing in a Softball World Seriesthere so we have to make this a week of our vacation, and the hotels there are getting reservation cancelations in big numbers.. Would anyone go to the beach for a vacation when the ocean is full of oil making the beaches unpleasant for vacation. How much money will the Coastal areas lose in tourist , not to speak of fishing industries? Of course Obama and his crooked staff doesn't even have to take the blame for this, unless it can and probably will in the coming years be proven that it was a conspiracy. So they will come up with any reason not to get this mess cleaned up soon. They will find a reason not use hay to to do this, because they would never want to admit it was a couple of farmers that came up with a solution.
Contracts have already been let to environmental cleanup companies. They would most likely be the ones to adopt any 'new' or different technology. These companies might have contracts that specify what they'll do, EPA approved, etc., so would have to convince government bureaucrats that that something new and different should be tried. Bureaucrats are not imaginative people by nature and are more interested in protecting their jobs than taking any risk.
WE as Americans seeing a solution that is enviornmentally safe (as opposed to chemicals) helps our Farmers (part of the blue collar backbone of America, of which I proudly am) a way to soak it up and pick it up saving fisher's livelihood, oyster beds, fish and wildlife.. WE should be sending this info each of us to whoever our representatives are including those in Washington DC. This solution will not make corporations who produce chemicals rich but will solve the problem an help fellow Americans along with preserving a way of life. is there a question? because so far I've not heard a word in the media of this. I've emailed this to all in my contact lists. We should watch this very closely.
What the man is doing with the spatula is simulating waves that occure in the Gulf. Some people don't listen good.
I suggest that the US Gov pay for the use of straw and hay to collect all of the oil spill it can and then claiming salvage rights process that straw to remove the oils and add it to our reserves as well as sell into the summer season to reduce the price of gas.
Now, I know this probably a pipe dream because our government has not displayed much concern for us average citizens in quite a while and since this kind of thing would be a cost effective, environmentally friendly, and possibly net positive in terms of cost the problem is that it just don't put money in the pockets of the new royalty now does it.
Well, no pun intended, at the very least we need to get the hay to the coast to protect the wetlands and beaches.
I try to spread this info everywhere, regarding oil spill clean-up. Mycologist Paul Stamets conducted an experiment using oil-contaminated soil and inoculated it with Oyster mushroom spawn. The Oyster mushrooms have the ability to "eat" oil, by breaking hydrocarbon bonds. Look up his video "6 Ways Mushrooms Can Save the World" on YouTube. Experiment is shown about halfway into the video. Let's expand on this hay/straw idea to capture oil, but with mushrooms. Please go watch the video if you don't believe me.
Homeland InSecurity is one of the biggest problems to the oil clean-up. We might have to do it no matter what those thugs say or dictate. Homeland InSecurity is Anti-American and Anti-Freedom as well as a gigantic Stalinist bureaucratic boondoggle.
The quantity of hay is going to be immense. I like this idea. However, that said, how much hay would it take. What would happen to the cost of hay to those that use it to feed livestock, etc. The hay is still subject to the old rule of supply and demand, so you know the cost of hay will shoot skyward like a 4th of July bottle rocket. Those selling the hay will make out, but why shouldn't they? They didn't cause the problem. Eennie, Miennie and Moe that were on the tv before that congressional hearing were at fault so let those bozo's pay the tab. There's also the cost of transporting it to the gulf spill (flat trailers and tractors and barges)probably this would be something that rail could get on board with and load up the cattle cars with hay/straw. But, I repeat, for those who consume straw and hay, be ready to pay some mighty fancy prices when this happens. And, yes, the cost of not doing this is going to be a whole lot more than the price of hay/straw going up. I'm aware of that. Good luck on making this happen and congratulations to the two men who came up with this idea. The fellow who went on about his exploits in Singapore forgot tot mention in his letter that he got this idea from the two fellows who put the video together. Let's give credit where it's do!!
AMAZING! I have shared with everyone I know.
Keep it simple stupid. Yes, it may be a long shot for the government to do this...but if they were smart, it would be perfect. Less money, quick clean up AND
as he said, "it's about as green as you can get!"
Please everyone should send this video to the White House and your local representative.
How much hay would it take? Here is a rough estimate:
If a standard bale is enough to treat 6 square yards of water and the average bale weighs 50lb, then to treat an oil slick 10 miles by 3 miles in area it would take about 383,000 tons of hay. (This is probably a low estimate.)
The US on average grows 15 million tons of hay annually. The amount readily available in the coastal area is significantly less than that.
I'm sure you will find hundreds of 10x3 mile oil slicks out on the Gulf by now.
PS: I am a farmer in Ohio.
The equipment is in operation all over the world to pick up the saturated hay. Call up The Kelco Company in San Diego and put there harvesters to work. Scoop up the hay and off load it to barges and have all the Co Generator operators take it for fuel. There are many logging operations in Oregon and other states that would be happy to burn it. Get the bureaucrats out of it and let the free market system work!
The problem, as someone else pointed out, is that the floating straw will attract wildlife. If this idea was enacted, which it will not be, it would actually compound the ecological problem by camouflaging the spill to wildlife and making the ecological disaster worse.
Wildlife for the most part will instinctively keep away from an oil spill. Some will still be caught up in any oil spill, but for the most part wildlife stays away from spills. The smell is warning enough, if wildlife has an option to leave, it will.
There are thousands of substances that absorb Oil and we have known about them for decades. If you used straw you would have birds building nests from it, eating it, laying eggs in it and so forth. Greater risk of introducing it into the food chain etc.
Unfortunately, and I am sad to say this, but the spill is likely being contained and kept from the coast with the intention of letting it dissipate out into the ocean through the Gulf Stream. The focus of concern is likely much more on how to stop the blow out, not on how to gather the Oil.
I'm sure the good Dr. has alot of experience with oil gushing a mile underwater. That being said a couple of rednecks with two pots is not going to convince me - Sorry.
Awesome idea. Unfortunately if they were serious about cleaning up this mess, they would be reacting to it exactly like a WAR. (If a terrorist group somehow managed to pull this off, we'd already be massing troops to invade the next country)
The cleanup operation is quite frankly weird... why aren't there a hundred thousand people converging on something of this magnitude? Instead, it seems like the response is "give BP employees some overtime"...
Why wait for someone else to do it? ? It's truly easier to get forgiveness than permission - the gumment/ BP corp has been dicking around for three weeks plus, and have accomplished virtually nothing, there are now millions of gallons of oil floating toward shore. Somebody please just get the hell out there and do it, and once we can all see it's working, TPTB will be shamed into doing it on a massive scale...
Oh my, so many preconceived and spontaneous ideas. Lets not forget that the major work going on is to stop the leak … no matter how unsuccessful.
As for the second problem, the cleanup, I saw a couple ounces of refined oil get picked up by a couple hands full of hay. At 100,000 gallons per day, were NOW needing ~5 million bales of hay spread over 10,000 square miles.
Landscapers have the tools for that to run up and down the beaches. Hopefully, those who saw all the XS hay sitting around can find 10-20,000 of those piles. I won't live long enough for the bacteria to nibble it away.
Next problem is to find all the other components of crude that have dissolved into the sea.
Here in Florida we are using dog hair! Grooming parlors in particular are sending bags of dog hair. I've seen some of the pictures of it and it really does work!
Are they using saltwater in their demo? If so, this looks like a very practical approach.
Are they using saltwater in this demo? If not, it probably would not affect the outcome.
Really?
I can think of many reasons why this would not work:
It's too simple.
Would mess up farm subsidy program (farmer's are paid not to grow)
We don't do bailout's for Farmers.
It would deplete our hay supply.
Who do these guys think they are?
It would destroy the balance of power in the farmbelt.
Our cows would starve and die.
It would be a bailout for a foreign company - British Petroleum.
It would divert national news coverage back to the economy and war
It would become a Letterman top 10 subject for several years.
Great idea- American ingenuity of what this country started on at its best. Way to go gentlemen. Let's just hope you convince someone in Washington to listen to someone besides themselves!
Our 6th grade science class thinks these guys are awesome!!!! We hope the goverment will listen to these brilliant men!
I believe that all parties involved with this and any other oil spill need to try this procedure. it appears to work very well!!
These guys are freaking geniuses!! What an awesome idea.
Send this to your representative in Washington.
Fascinating idea! The uqestion I have is that would the amount of salt and sand in ocean water make a difference in the ability of the hay to absorb/gather the oil?? RBL
another option they are looking to do is using hair dose not matter if its human or animal but you should check that out to i believe that both are great
can't put it in a dump. have to burn it. because of salt content (small as it is it's going to corrode the waste gas system quickly. the fly ash will have salt as part of fallout on nearby fields. rain will activate and burn crops.
great idea,but is the effecy the same in "salt" water????
All those who see government as unresponsive and ignorant seem to have forgotten that it has been private industry that created the problem and has been trying unsuccessfully for 35 days to fix it.
You're right. BP is an embarrassment to private enterprise. Of course, Chernobyl was worse.
Keep in mind that advocates of private enterprise who are not outright "Whigs" or apologists for big business (an example of the apologist school would be Judge Richard Posner and most of the two major parties) would say that private property is sacrosanct and as a result BP should be held liable for every penny of damage it has caused. As well, the public has an interest in the oceans, and a properly running private enterprise system would hold them financially liable for the damage they do to the oceans as well.
A well working government would force BP to cover the cost of every penny of damage it has caused. If they went into bankruptcy, then the assets should be used for that purpose.
The sad truth is that government functions as a protection to big business, not as its proponents claim a countervailing power.
Until the 1970s common law was evolving to create better protections to the public to penalize creeps and morons like BP. In response, the EPA was established in the early 1970s, in effect protecting big business from the evolution of common law toward penalizing them. The EPA has served to protect polluters, not to reduce pollution.
BP probably would not exist in its current, incompetent and moronic form without various subsidies from government. These include monetary expansion and regulation like the Sherman Anti-trust Act that have encouraged corporate takeovers and mergers. BP is probably mismanaged in part because it is too big. It is too big because of monetary expansion's covering the incompetent management.
It has always been odd to me that the left advocates an elastic money supply that subsidizes waste in big business, then complains about the environmental damage that the regulations they've put in place facilitate.
So the problem is not just business, but government as well.
This is absolutely incredible! If Washington doesn't listen to these men they are abosolute idiots! Obviouslt they know what they're talking about and are smarter than the 16,000+ others who haven't come up with a solution yet! It's natural and easy to clean up. What could be wrong with that!?
Too simple, practical & cost effective for this government. They are addicted to spending "our" money!!!!!!!!
Well I have known for many years that BulRushes would work. They absorb something like 400x their weight. If we had land for growing these we could use them to absorb heavy oil weight from water...very green and someone would have a profit from growing them in marshes...
Would someone please tell me why this has not been on a news station like FOX. And, one more question, why hasn't it been tried to save the shores?
If you haven't done it already, you might consider sending this to the major news networks to get the ideal out there.
I was wondering also, with all the grass clippings that are thrown into landfills, would that work as good as hay? It's free, throw away material that could be collected in the community and trucked.
Do you REALLY think our government is going to listen to anyone else but themselves. Honestly, these are men of the Earth, they know what they are talking about, they are not in it for profit.......
I need to see it work. I need to see a clear 73 quart bin from walmart with oil floating in it. Drop in the hay, shake the bin for a wave simulation. It gives the viewer a close up view. Get the camera closer to the speakers and the demonstration. Simulate a net from a fishing vessel to solidify the practical water removal solution. The cooking utensil makes it seem more like a delicatessen. For God sake, fill a pool with oil to make a point. The cooking utensil makes it seem more like a delicatessen.
Although it's a great idea, this cleanup solution will likely necessitate impractical amounts of hay (anyone know how much is needed for 1000 gallons?).
Adria Brown's Golden Retriever oil spill clean up method has a much greater chance of being adopted on a large scale. As stated in the patent: "For spills between 100,000 and 1,000,000 gallons, somewhere on the order of between 60,000 and 600,000 cubic feet of entire corn cobs might by required".
According to a Press release issued June 2, Ms Brown's company Recovery I, Inc. stands ready to respond (Read Press Releases and other articles on this method at http://Recovery.Windenberger.com).
And I stand ready to assist anyone in creating unconditional freedom from anything in their heart and mind that stands in the way of getting rid of this unwanted disaster now.
Dr Claude Windenberger
Unconditional Freedom Coach
Excellent Idea Guy's! The farmers of this great nation are definitely the most valuable people we have.What are we waiting for,do it! Time is money! Anything done to start the clean up process is better than nothing.Obama you are a huge disappointment to our young generation who your success was won on. Shame on you!Let these farmers show you how to clean up this oil spill. Maybe for once you should listen to the people.
Why is everyone asking for permission to save our own land and waters? Would we ask their permission if our coast were being invaded by terrorist insurgents? I think not - we would be out there heavily armed and ready to kick some arsch! Any private sector folk working plan and strategy? There are a bunch of us who can help 'implement'... but cannot find the folks on the web and need a start. Pls let me know for have some ideas to get this moving and need to know why others have tried.
Why is everyone asking for permission to save our own land and waters? Would we ask their permission if our coast were being invaded by terrorist insurgents? I think not - we would be out there heavily armed and ready to kick some arsch! Any private sector folk working plan and strategy? There are a bunch of us who can help 'implement'... but cannot find the folks on the web and need a start. Pls let me know...
(From Fort Myers, FL) Several bonafide solutions out there. Even ones already approved by Coast Guard and EPA but being IGNORED. If I could, I would be creating a consortium, JV and IMPLEMENT as insurgent ALL workable solutions regardless of source. People would then see relevant action that is actually working to resolve this mess. You would think one of BP’s competitors would have spearheaded something like this by now for this is an excellent PR opportunity and a bonus, save the Gulf. Negotiations would start like this… All rigs be retrofitted with acoustic triggers, only about a $500K investment/rig. The same or (or better) remote-controlled shut-off mechanisms mandated on Norwegian and Brazilian rigs since the early ‘90s. Manufacturers include Kongsberg Maritime AS, Sonardyne Ltd. and Nautronix PLC. These are currently in use by Royal Dutch Shell PLC and France's Total SA.
I will save your earth NOW; on condition provide me drilling rights, immediate patent protection and royalties on use of all of my solutions provided they are now mandates of all who drill on US territory. Because I am a environmentally conscious, responsible driller. The result would be excellent reputation/PR, positive shift in public perception to support safe drilling, lessening the dependency of America on foreign oil. Our shares would skyrocket, folks would get their economies, marine life and beaches back. If wanted to could then absorb BP since they will be left in the oil wake... searching for a bailout... ie ME. What do you think?
I spoke with a friend who owns a business in Gulf Shores Alabama this afternoon.
He said there was literally hundreds of people ... walking the beaches with trash bags picking up globs of oil / tar etc ... they are limited to only ten minutes of picking up then they are required to rest for 20 minutes .. .this is OSHA dictating this schedule ...
Folks, there are machines designed to do this. Just look under Barber Beach and Sand cleaners on the internet. Not only would they do the job faster, they would do a better job because they clean below the surface of the beach. These workers are just picking up the stuff on the top of the sand !
So now we know what the plan is ... this is another way to created jobs, keep OSHA busy, and prolong this oil spill thing indefinatly.
If we did the hay thing ... it would put those poor folks on the beach out of work a lot sooner ... So why not let nature take the oil to the beach and let the overworked (I'm kidding) beach patrol clean it up.
The hay thing would work ... it just would not employ enough people and the government won't be in control.
Right now there's a Rich guy (BP) out there, bending over with his wallet open ... and his pants around his knees !
The only folks that can make this happen is BP and the Media ... but if it works ,,, what kind of story is that ... they want the people stooping over picking up oil on the beach to look like the poor tree huggers they really are. The hay thing would be news for one week, the people on the beach will be news for years .... Pray for your nation ... we are in bad trouble !
this idea would clean up the oil, and coupled with the SQUID (New World Innovation's Super Quick Undersea Incident Device) would fix the whole problem in the Gulf! See the video on YouTube by searching for squiddevice.mov or go to http://newworldinnovations.com/pages/squid.aspx
Some call it "Yankee Know How". It's what made our country great--and what we've applied in war to keep our country free. That visceral knowledge of how to do things--in a simple but effective way--comes from the heartland--from our farms--from our rural heritage.
God bless you all for your great ideas. It restores my hope that we are not losing our ability to apply "Yankee Know How". I hope someone in Washington is listening to all these ideas. And I hope they have enough "Yankee Know How" of their own to select the best of the ideas and very quickly put them to work in the Gulf of Mexico.
The following was posted on the cnbc web site earlier today.
Hay
Road construction companies use hay to control soil erosion along highways and back roads. As it turns out, hay can also be used to soak up oil spills and leave clean water behind.
To protect against the effects of the BP spill, Walton County in the Florida panhandle recently entered into an agreement with CW Roberts Contracting , a local road construction company, to use hay to mop up the oil creeping towards its beaches. Originally, the company had offered this low-tech cleanup solution to BP, but they were turned down.
Most experts believe that if techniques like this were used in the water on a large-scale, they could potentially compound the problem, as the oil-soaked hay itself would need to be retrived over a vast area.
To Admin:
True enough that the hay would have to be retrieved on a large-scale basis, but this could be done -- check my comments earlier in this blog regarding the cleanup of the Singapore harbor under "Bettu said..."
Thank you so much for posting this.
I'm betting that by now BP has been swarmed with emails and phone calls about this treatment. I'll be adding an email to the pile shortly.
We have such brilliant minded men and women, with such great ideas.I can't understand why they are not using the ideas of these men to clean up this oil spill. I think it is better to at least give it a try, there is always the possibility that it will work..and will make for a safer future. Brilliant men have made the first Air Plane, the Telephone, the electricity. This is was done many years back and look at it now.I think they should give this a try too..It is so simple but could perform a miracle.. I wish these brilliant men the very best and find the answer soon.
Thank you.
Snowgirl in Canada
This wouldn't work, the amount of hay would be a staggering amount 1) to get it there 2) to harvest. And its not the clean up thats the problem, its the fact it is still pouring out. they need to close off the source before they can clear it up.
Could they possible just put the hay near the mouth of the inlets to at least keep some of the oil out of that area. Covering the entire Gulf would be impossible, but near the shore line in certain areas might work.
This is too good an idea! The powers that be won't allow it though because it's just too obvious!!! A New Zealand guy came up with a similar idea using wool years back specifically for cleaning up all spills. Millions of little wool puffs, suck up and hold the oil. Dispersed by plane or boat the wool holds the oil because wool is meant to 'hold' oily tannins naturally. The the wool balls are 'harvested' back on board a ship for disposal. Man I hope BP and the Government listen to people for a change. Just for once can't they do it right?
I doubt the Government will listen to anyone other than those connected "cleanup" companies that give KICKBACKS to politicians. The Hay idea is great though bales of Straw is better as straw is hollow inside and absorbs more. Years ago I saw a private owned service station use SHREDDED USED CIGARETTE Filters to soak oil in their service bays. IT soaked it right up to almost every drop! Some 50 miles inland on the west coast of Florida there is countless hay and straw growers-farmers-tens of thousands of bales of straw for sale.
Here is a solution for the root cause of the problem
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdW7EVWx3Q4
I say we have ourselves a good old-fashioned "hay party" instead of waiting for the government and BP to take their heads out of their asses! Why don't we load up our trucks and just dump sh-tloads of hay into the water! What are we waiting for???
When are you people going to realize the reason why our government hasn't stepped in and order the use of hay yet? Because like BP, they are looking for a way to salvage the oil as much as possible to make money off of. IT"S ALL ABOUT THE MONEY. The only thing they hear is that "oil attaches itself to hay". They don't hear anyone saying how easy it will be to remove the oil after wards for further use. IT'S NON PROFITABLE. With all the money that BP is paying out, they want to recover those expenses or at least a portion. We don't need talk of hay being put into use. We need action. If OBAMA and his lackeys are not going to do something now then we need to take action ourselves. Start petitioning to get these people out of position to do nothing and put someone in the position to do something!!!!
Too costly and labor intensive. Check out OIL EATING MICROBES: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-yVBXfW9Z4
great idea! really.
Those of us feeding livestock with
coastal and bahia supplies from the local gulf coast are already concerned though about our feed 'sources' being used to cleanup or at least stop oil on the beaches. We've had shortages in past years due to Hurricanes, Tropical storms (remember all the barns storing the current years hay lost their roofs in Opal, Ivan, etc). and we've had hay shortages due to drought and then to too much rain other years! If we can't feed our livestock, do we qualify for BP's lost wages or lost way of lives? Dead horses or cows count as personal losses?
Please buy the hay & straw out of the affected areas. We usually run out of hay before the new hay comes in!
Check this out, folks:http://www.brasschecktv.com/page/872.html
The guy talking about "Mount Helen" at the bottom of Gulf soon.
Florida students already discovered plums of heavily carbonized oil hanging at 600-700 feet deep off the surface in huge quantities. Drilling at such dept may open some scary "Pandora box". Listen on his pressure explanation. Its insane physical condition and no one could do ANYTHING with the Planet "blow valve".
It sure sounds like a good solution. Brilliant! Let's get some crude in a swimming pool and try it out!
Nice post thanks for sharing with us. i like it. i also know about some new oil/chemical spill control site that provide you better results in spill cleanup with their effective products.
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